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April 08, 2007



There is no technology, no matter how clean, that somebody won't oppose.

Wind turbines kill birds.

Solar power covers sensitive desert.

And now wave power ruins the surf.


The problem with NIMBYs and BANANAs and NIMTOOs, along with assorted lefties and ultra-right environmentalists is that it is not so much that you are disrupting their lifestyle, but that you as a private entity are supposedly benefitting obscenely from "socialized" energy. If it were a top heavy high-overhead inefficient socialist government who would want to develop this energy resource, they would not care the least and would not protest.

In other words, it may look on the surface as a lifestyle issue - but in reality it is the age old quesion of socialism vs. private property and private initiative.


Beek- It's called Ecofascism http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eco-fascism and it's all the rage now.

Big Tom

Why don't we ask the EnviroOracle Al Gorebels what
should be done./puke


Did any of you RTFM? Where in there is this REALLY about private vs. public? Seems like you missed the part that said "In one corner stand the local authorities and power companies," this project has the backing of power companies and local authorities, so you're whole private vs. public argument is shall we say...off topic.


Zoe - RMFM again. The issue is the ownership of the energy. The local authorithies will NOT own the energy, and will not receive the revenue from the investment. It will be the private interests who will own it.

The local governments will just get to collect some energy generation tax, that is all. But ownership, control, and profits belongs to those who develop the energy. So if the eco-leftofascists cannot get their hands on that income (because they have no idea how to develop the energy and nobody will trust their money with them anyways), then they want nobody to get their hands on that lost energy, and prefer to see it wasted and society live in a lower state.


Breakwater wave installations would not face opposition like this. Neither would wind/wave power platforms floating offshore.

I believe these are the underwater wave energy collectors? Not visible from the surface, but still maybe a problem.

Put them further offshore where they will not effect the surf.

Forget the idiotic troll politics. It's more limbaugh/drudge BS. Too bad that engineers tend to be vulnerable to this stuff. Is it their frustration at having their profession ruled over by salesmen,lawyers, and accountants?

That's my take on it. Scientists and engineers used to run technology based business entities. No more, now salesmen generally run them, with teams of accountant and lawyer underling tyrants. Who torture engineers into towing the corporate line, no matter how idiotic that path may be.

Such as continuing to use oil powered internal combustion engines as the prime mover of transportation energy policy.


Actually, I generally hear the opposite argument... especially on this website. Usually it comes down to "if private companies want to do something, its good. If governments want to do something, its bad."

That mentality of ivory-tower liberterianism is rampant on the internet. Luckily it represents a tiny and shrinking percentage of the actual population. Most folks just want things to work, and don't care whether its the government or a private company or a public-private partnership or an NGO that makes it happen.


DG, except that it never works at cost, when the government gets to build and operate the thing.

I am in the energy business and I see the same job that is delivered by the private sector, takes 2 to 3 times as much cost (and generally that much extra time) for the government to deliver.

So yes indeed, society is very interested to see that jobs get done in an effective and cost efficient manner. How would you feel if your standard of living was 1/2 or 1/3 of what it is now (as in the Soviet Union)?

The common fallacy is to judge a program without considering material costs. Yes, then I am sure the government can gold-plate the project better than anybody in the private sector (at somebody else's expense) - no doubt - they are already doing that.

My suggestion for those who are clueless about costs and advocate government projects is that we get a quote from a private contractor, and the pro-government folks should pay the extra cost difference. Problem is that they want to selfishly spread their idealistic costly programs to the society at large. In other words, their own money is not where their public mouth is.


The worst of both sectors beek, private contractors working for government. they can waste tax dollars at an astronomical rate. The goal of the Reagan revolution and the Newty contract on america. federal bankruptcy. We are almost there, with china holding the mortgage.

The 140 tons of hundred dollar bills that dissappeared into Iraq? A joint government/contractor venture.

Outsourcing tax dollars to private industry is the absolute worst combination for we the people who pay the bills.


Up to 11% reduction in wave height? Guess I'd be concerned if I was a surfer. Maybe they'd rather have Nuclear? Not all wave farms will be built off of coast lines with surfing beaches.

Solar doesn't cover sensitive desert if it is on the roof or walls of your house.

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Android Tablet PCs

You can discover what Steven Carew "has got" by visiting wholesale the website for Rhino Hydro. There are a few "update" items there, dated 2004.

But, the essence of Steve's invention is described under the "technical" menu selection, as follows:

"This electro generating plant employs magnets and springs to help create a perpetual motion which hiphone drives a generator. Thus giving you the electricity you need."

Get the picture, Jason? Hard to imagine Steve can't get funding . . .2945abc45 0422







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