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April 30, 2007

Comments

Cameroon

Great. Everything's always for the good old military.

JD

And your point is....?

Cameroon

The point being that they put so much money and resources into military hardware and military adventures. Too bad other areas don't get so much attention. The priorities are all wrong.

Engineer-Poet

And the first use for commercial products going to a Swedish company... does that indicate erroneous priorities also?

Cameroon

If lots of people start using battery powered lawnmowers instead of the stinky, noisy & polluting gasoline driven ones, then that's definitely not erroneous. Maybe the US mower companies will also start developing them, unless they stay stuck in the old days.

Greg woulf

That they're selling to Husquavarna makes me feel a lot better. I would be with Cameroon if not for the link. Thanks E-P.

Hopely the way it'll play out is that the military will pay for development and we'll reap the rewards.

This is a battery that can work in EV's, maybe not as good as A123, or Altair, but cheaply enough that middle class can afford it.

Harvey D.

Good news and a good alternative to high cost batteries for many applications.

This could be a very good solution (and a good business deal) for low cost Chinese built e-bikes + scooters.

Replacing 1+ million ICE cars-bikes with 1+ million affordable e-bikes/scooters in large cities would make a real difference for air pollution and GHG + reducing liquid fossil fuel consumption.

Kuala Lumpur. Beijing, Mexico City, Sao Paulo, LA, Tokyo, New Delhi, Calcutta, Hong Kong etc would be good places to start.

China is already producing e-bikes/scooters at the rate of 5+ millions/yr and could double or triple that rate rather quickly with lower cost batteries. India could do likewise, including replacing the current ICE polluting 3-wheeler low cost taxis.

Kit p

Good news, a better battery to start my infrequently used ICE. Every few year I research what is new in batteries. I spend more money on batteries for my sail boat than I do gasoline.

It is interesting that Firefly does not discuss cost. If the cheapest marine battery at Sears or Cosco only last 3 years, they are better value than more expensive values. However, if I was planning on open ocean cruising, I would select more rugged and reliable batteries.

More evidence all forms of EVs are DOA for the POV market. Sure you can save small amounts of money by buying off peak electricity, but you have to buy expensive batteries with uncertain life.

Reality Czech

And the Prius taxis in Vancouver which have racked up 200,000+ miles on one battery is proof of what, exactly?

That you lie and obfuscate, I suppose.

Greg woulf

Kit, I have no idea how you take a breakthrough in battery technology to be evidence that EV's are dead.

I think that's some kind of funnel thought process you have.

Jim from The Energy Blog

Firefly has been my dark horse to develop the battery to replace current battery technology rather than Li-ion technology. This announcement is a great step forward, even though it apparenty will be a few years before they are avaiable for cars. They will be cheaper, 1/5th the cost of NiMH, and have current availability of a manufacturing and recycling structure. Even when sucessful, Li-ion will have to deveop a recycling structure as sources of lithium (in an inexpensive form), are limited and cannot develop fast enough to keep up with potential demand. An earlier post described the Firefly battery technology in greater detail.

Kit P

What breakthrough? It is a press release!!!! I see a complete lack of critical thinking here. There will be no press release when the company goes broke because there great idea turned out to be just another bad theory.

I am a little ticked at batteries at the moment. My POS PU will not start. It is an electrical problem. Starter was replaced just 30k miles ago and this will be the third battery replacement since then. Of course I would be obfuscating because the starter was replaced in 2001 and this POS is used for my daily commute.

I have put 250K miles on an ICE PU without needed a new starter or battery, only routine maintenance.

The only point here is that duty cycle and maintenance are important factors. When I see an objective study of EV POVs being better than ICE, then fine I may change my mind. EV are DOA because you all are waiting for a breakthrough that is just around the corner.

Does anyone want my whole list of why EVs are DOA?

Engineer-Poet

As long as you post it on your own blog.  Most of us can use a good laugh.

JD

"The point being that they put so much money and resources into military hardware and military adventures. Too bad other areas don't get so much attention. The priorities are all wrong."

Your political baggage is showing. Just how does the military( most probably the Army which uses predominately 24 volt batteries for their vehicles) establishing a purchase contract with a private firm misdirect resources? Probably this purchase is the key point that might keep this company in business.

Does this somehow prevent said company from running a production line for 12 volt batteries? Different production lines just like the one for the Husqvarna contract. I would also be curious about the actual status of development since they've apparently not made inroads into the auto battery area (to my knowledge). Or is it your belief that government should be fully subsidizing your favorites rather than conducting these alluded to adventures?

I'll leave it at that. Your attitude has to much in common with other attitudes I've observed in the past. Mostly at west coast airports in the early 70's when I was in uniform.

Engineer-Poet

FYI:  Firefly Energy is a spinoff of Caterpillar, founded specifically to pursue this battery technology.  It does not do any manufacturing; instead, it contracts for production from others.

This could really be something, because the process can be licensed to existing producers much faster than Firefly could create its own assembly lines.

amazingdrx

Right on jim, I want firefly batteries instead of lithium. Cheaper, almost as light, and the slower charge is not a problem when you only need 6kwh of storage that can be charged up overnight.

No need for quick charge in an eV if you have a backup generator.

amazingdrx

Sure kitty, post your reasons why the EV is dead. Rwwwwrrrrr. cat fight. As Olbermann says, "Here kitty, kitty, kitty".

Shawn

JD, I say hooah to that. If it weren't for the Army, and the military in general, a lot of stuff wouldn't be here today... wasn't this whole internet thing we're using a product of DARPA? Too bad that money didn't go elsewhere...

cameroon

Obviously it's good for the company, these military contracts. I guess in this case it's not too bad because it may actually lead to some positive spin-off in the civilian world where it really counts with regard to the environment. Too bad the same can't be said for a lot of the other military technology spending. Mostly it just leads to a big hole in the governments coffers, and a lack of money for other important services.

JD

Engineer Poet

My comment still applies. Okay they contract production out(I'll take your word for it due to lack of interest) instead of producing themselves. Same thing, if they don't get purchasing orders from a costumer then Capterpillar will simply shut them down as a non-profitable subsidiary. This actually makes them more likely to dissapear if they're non productive.

Engineer-Poet

They have no expenses for production lines, only licensing revenue.  Unless their technology is eclipsed by something better (which would be great for the world), how can they go broke?

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SEO Los Angeles

Excited to see this new battery technology out for the consumer.

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