Hydrogen or Batteries by 2020?

According to a Reuters report on last weeks National Hydrogen Association annual conference at the Long Beach Convention Center:

Hydrogen fuel proponents see 2020 as the year it all comes together.

Not only will there be affordable zero-emissions hydrogen-fueled cars in every showroom but in 2020 a smattering of houses across the world will be lighted with electricity from hydrogen-powered home generators.

Even proponents agree there are four major hurdles researchers need to solve before the fuel can be used widely: storage, fuel cell durability, affordability and a delivery system.

That is good news to me.  By that time plug-in cars and EV's should have been available in production quantities for eight years or so and the need for fuel cell vehicles should have gone away.  Both methods are very dependent on electricity to produce the "juice" (hydrogen or electricity) that goes into cars. The overall efficiency of an electric car is more than twice that of a hydrogen car eliminating the need to build many billions of dollars worth of generating plants and conserving our coal or nuclear resources for many years.  This will give us more time to ramp up our renewable energy sources so that by say 2050 we may able to get most of our energy from wind, solar, and ocean power and should have enough bio-liquids for producing biochemicals and to fuel the remaining vehicles that have not been converted to electric power.  There will be some expensive oil and natural gas available, but hopefully we will not have to use it for vehicles or to make electricity. Fuel cells may have some very good applications for stationary power in CHP applications where 85% of the energy in the fuel can be used. The transition to heating all buildings with either the waste heat from fuel cells or mass use of geothermal heat pumps will be well underway, eventually eliminating the need for fossil fuels for building heat.  Hopefully there will be some exotic way of producing hydrogen, such as from some mircrorganism, so that we don't have to use biofuels or electricity to make the hydrogen.

Technorati tags: hydrogen, fuel cells, energy, technology

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Comments

[Cervus]

I am franky skeptical. But if you compare our technology now to say, 1960, the differences are so massive that it just might be possible.

[Thomas]

Jim,
I agree with you 90% of the way. But watch out, here comes another one of my harsch comments:

Hydrogen for "home powerplants" is not a good idea! The only way you could get a decent efficiency would be to poduce the hydrogen inside the homes and store it in gigantic, virtually unpressurised tanks. Don't worry about storing energy for heat or cold; that's done much better with water.

If you were to produce hydrogen centrally (as opposed to in people's homes) you would stille need to transport the stuff, which is horribly inefficient, whether by pipeline of truck.

We don't (!) need hydrogen for thermal storage. With PHEVs or EVs we don't need hydrogen for eletrical storage either.

I think the most important message in the hydrogen discussion is the fact that we don't need it! There are better, cheaper, faster non-fossil alternatives. Don't let car companies fool you (not you Jim, I know you know better) into believing that we have to wait for hydrogen before we get zero emission vehicles.

Btw. I liked you comments in the first 90% that I agree with :-)

-Thomas

[odograph]

One reason I'm glad we don't have one world government, is that half the world's governments can pursue stupid ideas ... and things will still work out.

If hydrogen and batteries don't improve ... there are still bicycles and tiny little Brazilian style ethanol cars.

[Anthony]

Batteries should absolutely be the focus of research and development effort and dollars. Hydrogen fuel cells should be viewed as one type of battery among many and not as the primary solution to Earth's energy needs. Energy storage will be vital to reducing our need for hydrocarbon fuels, and efficient energy storage requires batteries.

An ideal electric grid would have 48 hours of battery storage. This would require storage for less than 50 dollars per kilowatt-hour stored and less than 500 dollars per kilowatt of installed capacity.

Rare elements like lithium and vanadium are too expensive for large-scale energy storage batteries. Sodium-sulfur batteries could easily meet the above price targets. Redox flow batteries are especially promising in their ability to lower the kilowatt-hour price of stored energy.

What renewable energy solely lacks is a large enough pool of dedicated hobbyists. The reason storage batteries and small wind turbines and solar panels are too expensive is that these products are not sold directly to the public. Hobbyists can change that.

[amazingdrx]

Yep jim, I agree.

I am awaiting the release of the new DeWalt power tools using the A123 nano-phosphate lithium-ion battery.

These are the most advanced mass produced batteries now available. Real world performance testing will prove their application to plugin electric vehicles.

Preliminary information seems to indicate that with these batteries an affordable 200+ mile range, 10 minute charge, plugin electric vehicle that weighs the same and has similar performance as a comparable oil fueled vehicle.

[amazingdrx]

Actually Anthony that level of storage, 48 gours worth is possible at the low cost you have envisioned.

Imagine 100s of millions of electric plugin vehicles being connected to the grid (when not being driven)as a kind of national distributed storage system, kind of like distributed power generation with solar and wind on individual homes and buildings.

Synchronicity between distributed renewable enerfy and battery electric plugin transportation. this also provides backup power for individual homes and businesses during storm related power outages, an increasingly serious problem with the severity and frequency of storms caused by global climate change.

http://amazngdrx.blogharbor.com/blog/_archives/2005/12/19/1455214.html

[eric blair]

Fuel cells that can take ethyl or butyl alcohol and make power are fuel cells I can get behind. (Still have to play with making my own butyl) A simple 1 stage distillation can get 70% ethyl alcohol, and if that can be placed into a fuel cell, all the better.

A way to take hydrocarbons and make power would elimiate the 'waste heat' of the present IC engine.

[Bruce]

Hydrogen is not the way. It is to keep the
control in the hands of the fuel producers.
Super Batteries puts Joe-Q in control.
Thats y G.M cancelled its Battery Program.
There is nothing that can compete with the
I/C engine for total economic delivery.
If there was; the Rail-Road & Trucking
would have it.

[heating]

If you have looked into solar energy as a method for heating your home, panels are usually the first things that come up.

There are, however, other unique methods.

The Solar Heating Aspect You Have Never Heard of Before

The power of the sun is immense. The energy in one day of sunlight is more than the world needs. The problem, of course,

is how does one harness this power. Solar panels represent the obvious solution, but they have their downside. First,

they can be expensive depending upon your energy needs. Second, they do not exactly blend in with the rest of your home.

Passive solar heating represents a panel free method of harnessing the inherent energy found in the sun for heating

purposes. If you come out from a store and open the door of your car in the summer, you understand the concept of passive

solar heating. A wide variety of material absorbs sunlight and radiates the energy back into the air in the form of heat.

Passive solar heating for a home works the same way as the process which overheats your car in the parking lot.

[New Balance Sneakers]

The more you fight something, the more anxious you become ---the more you're involved in a bad pattern, the more difficult it is to escape. Do you understand?