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« Maxwell Receives Order for 200,000 Ultracapacitors | Main | Another IGCC Plant »

January 27, 2006

Comments

BILL HANNAHAN

Yes there is a line separating your comment from your name, and nothing separating your name from the next comment.

This is why engineers should be required to take a human factors course.

Ed Cason 4753 Laverda Dr. Haltom City, TX. 76117

Being 75 yrs of age, with only a High School education, does not qualify me to speak the slang of you bloggers. In 1970 I had the chance to disassemble a capacitor. After seeing the sheet of foil and wax paper with a layer of yellow substance, layerd with a wire coming from each end, I feel that I know what the battery in discussion could look like inside. If my current Toyoto can be retrofitted with this new battery and electric motor, I want one. Dynamic braking reverses the polority of the armatur and field coil to break your speed or gear down. I want contact the the company making the batteries, to see what my chances of getting one are. You can buy all the stock in the company you want, just let me have an electric car. Oh, yeah I will pull my own generator to recharge with, for I don't want to put a strain on your electri grid. Ed the curious.

Will Carr

Mr. H.

You are correct in your comment elsewhere that nuclear energy is the only energy source at present that has the capacity to end the worldwide greenhouse experiment that could have devastating effects on the planet.

And look at what the oil cabal-military complex did to J Robert Oppenheimer who opposed the building of the H-Bomb and wanted nuclear plants built to liberate humanity, worldwide. They branded him a communist.

Kenneth Pitzer of Rice University (James A Baker Center for Public Policy), William Liscum Borden and Dr. Edward Teller plotted against JRO...resulting in his being stripped of his national security clearance. By the way, Borden wrote for the school newspaper at Yale with William Gardner "Ted" White, who was in the back seat of GHWB's Torpedo bomber in he South Pacfic during WWII.

Pitzer was working on high octane fuels for the hydro-carbon industry at the time of his killer testimony against JRO.

Who was building the pumps for the nuclear reactors? Dresser Industries.....CEO was Neil Mallon....GWHB's son is named Neil Mallon Bush after Dresser's long-time head.

So you can see why I'm concerned that EEstor and ZENN aren't given the same level of backing that their leading investment firm has given to other high tech endeavors.

I hope I'm wrong and that their technology is for real and that people could pay for a ten minute charge-up....or...as Ed Cason says....just take your own little generator with you.

WHC

fenwick409

Official Response from Zenn on delay of eestor

This posted by afjerry, September 11, at:
http://www.technologyreview.com/Biztech/18086/?a=f

"Dear Mr. Jerry,

There has been no official delay communicated directly to ZENN Motor
Company. This particular is in fact misleading in its story title. EEStor is quoted as stating that the EESU is on schedule for delivery to ZMC within the next ten months. That is not to say that they won't deliver before then - merely announcing the possibility that additional time may be required in the commercialization phase - not development time of the ultracapacitor.

The next milestone involves permittivity testing and no official 'due
date' has been announced.

Please feel free to contact me should you have any additional questions
or concerns.

Catherine Scrimgeour
Public Affairs Specialist
ZENN Motor Company
Tel: 416.535.8395 x 201
Fax: 416.535.4043
www.ZENNcars.com"

Ed Cason 4753 Laverda Dr. Haltom City, TX. 76117

I would like to be a test driver of a proto-type, retro fitted vehicle. If the people who have the patent on this capacitor device would allow this. I will return it upon your requested date, without any hassle to you. Then is the time I will bring the type vehicle I wish to have set up for my own use. Yes there are a lot other people who want the same thing. But I believe strongly that you have what you say you do. Thanks Ed Cason

Stas

Supercapacitors have been produced in Russia for several years now. Although the most powerful ones hold only 1KWh of energy weighting around 87 kilos in a volume of 0,08 m3 and used mostly to start up train and boat diesel engines in extreme cold conditions. Here is a link to a few producers (in Russian only): http://www.fis.ru/fis/tp/TradePlace.html?sp=7602476

So, 50 times improvement in capacitance using some breakthrough material is not that stellar - it should be doable.

PS: brainwashed yankee lunatics need not worry about the link - this is not some KGB scam you would adore to see, this is a business directory link

KarenRei

Just an observation, for those discussing the feasability of this invention: http://ipdiscover.com/pipermail/newcandle_ipdiscover.com/2006-March/000480.html --------- On the other hand, the EEStor device is just a plain old capacitor! A high dielectric constant material like barium titanate is used, and the ceramic particles are coated with other materials in order that they can be pressed and fired at a lower temperature. This is important; it allows the use of nickel rather than a more expensive metal for contactor electrodes. It also fills in the gaps between the particles of oxide, _very_ important for high capacity and voltage holdoff (arcing will first occur within the air gaps between the particles, due to the energy being concentrated there). With these two improvements, they apparently are able to fabricate a cheap planar type capacitor with substantial capacity and low ESR. I have no doubt that the device works, but can it be made competitive with a battery? Some problems come to mind, from my limited experience with barium titanate. First, it's not a linear dielectric. This can create problems on high rates of charge/discharge. I was amazed when working with a modern lead acid battery how fast a risetime I could get into a pulse circuit. Second, the dielectric is very temperature sensitive. This is seen in the phenomena called soakage, about which you can learn more from that venerable old graybeard Robert Pease, here. http://www.elecdesign.com/Articles/ArticleID/6096/6096.html Now car batteries get hot and cold, so your charge state may do some strange things as the weather changes. ---------- I've seen a lot of obvious scams that have attracted investment**. If this is a scam, it's certainly not an obvious one. As for two other issues that have come up: 1) "How do you charge it that quickly?" That seems pretty simple to me. These caps aren't that expensive or that big. Get a larger one, install it in your house, and hook it up to the power coming into your house. Charge from one cap into the other. It also would serve as backup power for your house. 2) "What about the extra grid power that you have to build?" As was noted, almost all of the vehicles at first will simply be charging off surplus capacity, since they can charge during "off hours", requiring little increase in required capacity. Beyond that, certainly new capacity is required. But so? Oil fields run out, and we're constantly having to drill new wells to keep up with *gasoline* capacity requirements. It's just switching from one type of capacity requirement to another. Unless the US were to suddenly switch from gasoline to electric overnight, it's not going to be a problem. ** My favorite obvious scam was the guy who was hunting for investors (and found some) for producing "tree power". He found that if he put a piece of copper pipe in the ground and drove an aluminum nail into the side of a tree, then held a multimeter up to them, he got a weak current. His idea was to tap the energy of entire forests. Lol -- anyone ever heard of a battery? One copper electrode, one aluminum electrode, and if anything in or on the tree can act as an electrolyte...

JohnGrogan

Greetings fellow seekers of truth...

Thank you for this delicious discussion and debate. EEStor or not, I am excited about the potential of the ZENN. Appropriate technology for each application.

The Canadian Government has finally given the ZENN a certification needed to operate on Canadian roadways... The Provinces on the other hand, are taking their sweet time. http://www.thestar.com/Business/article/286285 [We need restorative foot dragging technology]lol

I cannot wait. It is time to vote with my pocketbook. If I cannot operate a Zenn in Canada, I will invest in the stock while I am waiting... If the EEStor comes thru, all the better. Exciting prospects for alternative energy in any event.

Thank you again for a very informative (and entertaining) read.

Encourage and be encouraged...
Looking forward...
John G.
Canadian Rockies bioregion

Khanh

I don't quite believe in eestor but ...

Khanh

Sorry, forgot to post the link
http://www.energy-daily.com/reports/Lockheed_Martin_Signs_Agreement_With_EESTOR_For_Energy_Storage_Solutions_999.html

Yehuda Draiman

Humankind sustainability and improving the World, Society, and its Resources!

Yet who can the world trust to be idealistic and moral enough to help all of humanity and the environment, and at the same time, be practical enough to make extremely difficult decisions that can and will harm a great deal of people?

In only 12 years – between 1987 and 1999 – the world’s population increased by 20 percent, from 5 to 6 billion. This growth, in only 12 years – between 1987 and 1999 – the world’s population increased by 20 percent, from 5 to 6 billion. This growth, combined with dramatic increases in per capita resource consumption, contributes to increasingly serious social and environmental problems.

These problems will only worsen over the next 50 years as the projected world population nears 12 billion and developing nations become more industrialized. We are using finite nonrenewable resources at an ever-increasing rate, with little regard for future generations. Facing these facts, we are compelled to ask: are Earth and humankind sustainable?

People, governments and industries worldwide must adopt policies and practices that promote sustainable development.

Increased life expectancies, births to American citizens, and legal and illegal immigration, if continued, will dramatically increase the population of the US in the 21st century. In addition, the number of Americans aged 65 and over is projected to increase from 35 million in 2000 to 78 million in 2050 (Schneider 1999), and the present 4 million American citizens at age 65 will expand to 18 million by 2050. Unfortunately, many demographers believe that these projections are underestimates (Schneider 1999).
The increasing world population and the advancing technology worldwide is causing the accelerated depletion of natural resources and are creating genuine concern for maintaining our and future generations way of life.

The current depletion of fossil fuels is of major concern to world population today.

Any interruption in such commodity will cause a major economic downturn worldwide.

The issue is not to panic or cause panic, but to educate the public and the government the urgency of the impending crises and to take appropriate action to prevent such a catastrophe.

We have the science, knowledge and technology to overcome these impending energy crises.

We should accelerate our investment in research and development of renewable energy and energy efficiency, utilize energy efficient materials and systems to construct any new structures and in remodeling and rehabbing existing structures.

The amount of resources and funds should be a least a trillion dollar, this is a potential crisis of enormous magnitude, and we must utilize those funds wisely and carefully.

If we all pull together, the people the government and the scientific community, we can overcome these potential crises and enhance our living on earth.

In addition all we have to do is show the corporate world the financial benefit they can derive from such investment in those technology and we will see them all running to join the task of renewable energy at an affordable cost.

Yehuda Draiman

PS

What if humankind continues its present unsustainable practices for the remainder of the 21st century? What if nature’s laws stop the exponential growth of the human population and its concomitant destruction of natural capital and ecosystem services? If humankind continues unsustainable practices until it finds the answers to these last two ‘what ifs,’ this collapse will demonstrate that the human mind was an evolutionary failure. One hopes that reason guided by evidence, compassion, and ethics will make these two ‘what ifs’ merely speculative visions.

But, what augurs well for the future is that people are taking cognizance of what matters to the very future of humankind –
a sustainable and just world.

Be careful in what portfolio you invest in, some of those funds may end up in the hands of terrorists who want to kill you and your family.

David Doggett

I saw this item dated 10 Jan. 2008

"Lockheed Martin has signed a deal with EEStor to try to integrate the ultracapacitor start-up's electrical energy storage units into the defense contractor's products.

Financial terms of the agreement, announced Wednesday, were not disclosed. "

Maybe Eestor isn't dead yet...

Dave

E. Hansen

Have you all checked out the article mentioning EEStor in the Economist this week? Makes it seem more credible to me. It's actually how I heard about it.

Stephen

Prototype 150 mpg extreme hybrid SUV incorporates ultracapacitors, batteries and small gas motor.

http://www.afstrinity.com/

steve

Ref - nanocomposites that have a remarkable combination of high dielectric constant and high dielectric breakdown strength. Can anyone get me some data on this. steve - www.ukengineeringrecruitment.net

XpowerSaves

They make small capacitors for homes. If your electric bill is less than $200 you only need 1 unit, more than that you only need 2 units. It's all explained at the site, but these xpower savers can save you up to 25% on your electric bill.
These capacitors do the same thing that the big jobs do but, of course, on a smaller scale.
http://www.Got-Green-Energy.com

Kit P

Wow!!! What a slick set of scams just put the letter x in a word and promise saving money by spending lots. Here is an area that E-P could actually do a better job of explaining why.

Bluey

Seems Legit:

http://www.lockheedmartin.com/news/press_releases/2008/010908_LockheedMartinSignsAgreement.html

Be awesome to see it in use!

Jori A

I read this Bolg with intrest, and I conclude that the best way to fight high oil prices is to go electric and we can do it without building more nuclear power plants, sorry Ed Cason, but encourage eveybody to install PV arrays and mandate that the elctric utlities have to install 2way meters and have to buy the power at 60% of retail. This would encourage individuals to get involved.
There are many advantages to operating an electric vehicle and it would appear that we have the technological “know how and capability” to produce a vehicle like this, copmlete with a gas or propane emergency power plant back up system such as a Honda generator. It would probably cost less than an avarege sedan to produce and maintain, as there are far fewer moving parts. No transmission, no drive shaft, no transfer cases, just a small engine, a battery bank and capacitors.
This car could be built silmilar to a GM prototype “wafer frame constuction” vehicle, made of light metals and composites with the four wheels on indipendent suspensions. Each wheel hub is made as a DC motor, controlled by an 'on board' computer with “traction control” software. Acceleration by discharge of a large capacitor and recharge this cap with 'dynamic breaking'. The hood and roof of this vehicle are made of 'full spectrum photo cells' and used to keep the caps and batteries charging.
All I need is a 1hr range at 50MPH or 1hr30min at 30MPH, and if it is not sunny, then plug it in for a couple of hours to regain another 50 mile range. I would like this vehicle with two interchangable bodies, SUV style and pick-up style
How about it AMERICA, what would it take to have this, I am willing to pay a premium to be GREEN.
I would like to test drive some of these vehicles and I would pay for the privelege.

JJ

I noticed the website www.ultracapacitors.org talking about the use of ultrcaps in energy storage. I guess if EEStor's technology comes out it changes the game for all of the current ultracapacitor makers? Is that true? Would those companies be almost instantly out of business?

JJ

I noticed the website www.ultracapacitors.org talking about the use of ultrcaps in energy storage. I guess if EEStor's technology comes out it changes the game for all of the current ultracapacitor makers? Is that true? Would those companies be almost instantly out of business?

lloyd

Using the peizoelectric concept, has anyone ever tried directly heating hybrid fuel cell- solar cell concepts to directly produce electricty from waste heat?

Jack Mastbrook

Does anyone know the what ultracap technology Enova is using on their hybrid buses?

prefabrik ofis

thank you for nice info

Marc Perkel

Just a thought. If this technology were used not just for car batteries but for massive electrical storage like million volt DC transmission lines it could be a major component in a new future electrical distribution system.

Lyradius

I'm an inventor, I see lots of new uses for this. Let's consider this prior art so it remains open source. Here's the invention.

I have a place in the mountains, at the top of the mountain which gets all kinds of lightning throughout the summer when it's accessible.

I'd like to see a Lightning attracting system, which splits the current and charges the super or ultracapacitors. It might need an intermediate system, maybe even translation to a mechanical element like a flywheel. Or other system.

Lightning>Divide charge> Intermediate Capture Charge> Charge Supercapacitors > Use energy to run remotely

Optionally there could be a lightning strike system, like wire lead with model rocket.

Yea, It might sound like a dangerous place to live but it's one of many areas in the world that gets a lot of storms and the lightning that accompanies it, this could be a serious source of energy that when combined with Tesla technology, Finally there can be a way to capture the electricity created with a large Tesla Coil System. This is as green as it gets.

Daryl Tempesta
Hotdot.com

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good comments some brains are at work looking through the hype

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We are currently looking at combining our battery technology with ultracapacitors to make hybrid storage devices.

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It is a nice blog . I think now US should think differently and try to solve for the challenges we have now.It is a great idea if US government will start investing in the companies like EEStor to shorten the demand for oil from middle east.

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While super-capacitor knowledge is racing send on by the side of a fantastic walk up and down, we be supposed to get ready ourselves by proceeding to develop the requisite power conversion electronics intended for our immediate applications.
No more than with efficient and appropriate low-loss synchronous switching power conversion electronics already added to existing applications desire super-capacitors grow to be “Drop in the field of Solutions” to grow to be our extensive sought but heretofore no more than abstract solution to collect our “Ideal Battery” rations.

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Electric double-layer capacitors, also known as supercapacitors, pseudocapacitor, electrochemical double layer capacitors (EDLCs), or ultracapacitors, are electrochemical capacitors that have an unusually high energy density when compared to common capacitors, typically on the order of thousands of times greater than a high capacity electrolytic capacitor. For instance, a typical D-cell sized electrolytic capacitor will have a capacitance in the range of tens of millifarads. The same size electric double-layer capacitor would have a capacitance of several farads, an improvement of about two or three orders of magnitude in capacitance, but usually at a lower working voltage. Larger, commercial electric double-layer capacitors have capacities as high as 5,000 farads.[1] The highest energy density in production is 30 W·h/kg.[2]

Electric double-layer capacitors have a variety of commercial applications, notably in "energy smoothing" and momentary-load devices. Some of the earliest uses were motor startup capacitors for large engines in tanks and submarines, and as the cost has fallen they have started to appear on diesel trucks and railroad locomotives.[3] More recently they have become a topic of some interest in the green energy world, where their ability to store energy quickly makes them particularly suitable for regenerative braking applications, whereas batteries have difficulty in this application due to slow charging rates. New technology in development could potentially make EDLCs with high enough energy density to be an attractive replacement for batteries in all-electric cars and plug-in hybrids, as EDLCs are quick charging and exhibit temperature stability. They can also be used in PC Cards, flash photography devices in digital cameras, flashlights, portable media players, and in automated meter reading

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This can create problems on high rates of charge/discharge. I was amazed when working with a modern lead acid battery how fast a risetime I could get into a pulse circuit.

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When the watching hour arrives, you go to the dealer with the best offer, cheque in hand, and pick up your car. If there is any change in the terms, you go to the second-best showroom, although this shouldn’t be necessary.

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"The product weighs 400 pounds and delivers 52 kilowatt-hours". That is a goof weight to power ratio.

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Perhaps not. It seems that the time-honored act of buying your first new-to-you car in your teenage years is waning in popularity. And the same is also true of vehicles purchased from well-meaning parents for their children. According to CNW Marketing Research, in calendar year 2005, there were 7.5 million vehicles purchased by or for teens. In 2010, that number is expected to dwindle all the way down to 4.2 million.

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Technology is an issue that a lot of people tend to stay away from. I'm glad there are people that understand how it works and specialize in improving it. Do you think that cost of living will increase due to lack of power sources?

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UnclearFizzyCyst

Here's food for thought.

As it stands today we have 2 near-long term energy solutions for electrical generation. Nuclear and coal. Everything else is currently in the post-experimental stage.

Maximum efficiency is obtained via 24x7 operation of plants. Current 'best' method of obtaining this is to use off peak energy to pump water uphill for peak use as hydro generation.

An industrial scale super-capacitor would be an efficient solution for this problem, especially where water is scarce.

A good pilot for this may be a replacement battery for the Fairbanks back-up installation.

The comments to this entry are closed.

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